Sherpa Graph Id on Ebay - Albino

Joe_A

Moderator
Staff member
Enicaristi
Sherpa

What is especially interesting about this watch is that it is offered up as a one-owner watch with full set. It's the first full set offer I have seen for a Sherpa Graph:

[Image deleted at the request of a fellow who identified himself to a community member here as the owner and asked that the image be removed.]

S/N 561xxx is correct.

My albino Id has a red painted central chrono seconds hand and this one does not, but to me, it appears believable as it is.

I'm sure that Nico will weigh in on this one but there are so very few Ids accounted for so far it would be hard to insist that all albino versions had red central seconds hands..

[Image deleted at the request of a fellow who identified himself to a community member here as the owner and asked that the image be removed.]


Ditto for the remaining images.


Would it have sold for 15,000 EUR?

I guess we may not see anytime soon. ;)

The owner has informed a member here that he has decided to keep the watch and has ended the listing over at Ebay.

The photos will be visible at Ebay for a time.

A reason some watch forums encourage putting up copies of photo images of watches listed on Ebay is that eventually all listings, whether sold or not, disappear from Ebay.

What I am about to say is meant as a general statement and not meant to be applied to this specific watch.

There are avid hobbyists who keep track of interesting, rare or valuable watches and monitor how they may appear in the futire should they come up for sale again. Such horological sleuths may remark in future when a watch reappears with changes such as a new or different dial, hand set, etc.

My comment above is meant to offer an explanation as to why an Ebay link is not usable for archive purposes.

For reference, here is the face of mine:

ESG-1D-061119-2s.jpg
 

Hugger69

Member
Enicaristi
Sherpa
What a condition and so cool to we a full set like this! 🤩

But the watch was sold in 1964 and is a 1962 build or…?🙃😉
 

Joe_A

Moderator
Staff member
Enicaristi
Sherpa
The inside of the case should be stamped 6-62. Does that actually mean it was assembled in June of 1962? Probably. When would it have shipped to the selling jeweler? Could it have remained in a display case for a year and a half?

I' doubt these watches 'flew off he shelves' back then, but, we really do not know.

It would be interesting to learn how long it took watches of a certain type to travel from factory to wrist in that time period on average.
 

hurmen

Member
Enicaristi
Sherpa
The inside of the case should be stamped 6-62. Does that actually mean it was assembled in June of 1962? Probably. When would it have shipped to the selling jeweler? Could it have remained in a display case for a year and a half?

I' doubt these watches 'flew off he shelves' back then, but, we really do not know.

It would be interesting to learn how long it took watches of a certain type to travel from factory to wrist in that time period on average.

I always assumed the casemaker (EPSA) stamped the date inside the back when they produced the case.

So the date stamp only tells you the earliest possible time the watch could have been assembled, not when the entire watch actually was assembled exactly.
 

Joe_A

Moderator
Staff member
Enicaristi
Sherpa
I always assumed the casemaker (EPSA) stamped the date inside the back when they produced the case.

So the date stamp only tells you the earliest possible time the watch could have been assembled, not when the entire watch actually was assembled exactly.

That assumes that your assumption is correct - as far as who stamps the case backs. ;)

I don't have any idea myself . . .

One thing we can be reasonably sure about is that the assembly could not have taken place sooner than the date stamped inside, assuming that the cases were not stamped in advance! ;)

At some point, 1963 through mid 1966, Enicar or EPSA decided not to stamp a date inside and then later resumed doing so according to what we see on Nico's site.

So with the Sherpa Graphs, earliest stamping is 5-60 through 6-62 and then we have guesswork until 6-66 through 11-68

Aqua Graphs, nothing stamped until 6/66 as they did not exist until '63.

Same, same with the Jet Graph.

Cheers,

Joe
 
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Watchyouwant

New member
Sherpa
Was a good decision to withdraw it from the Bay under the current economic uncertainty . For that sort of asked Price it would have been there quite long and there is nothing worse than having listings go Stale and interested parties suspect something is wrong with it. With a lot of persuasion maybe Phillips in Geneva might take that because of the full set and get a good price.
 

Watchyouwant

New member
Sherpa
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Shall i answer in Russian ?
 

Joe_A

Moderator
Staff member
Enicaristi
Sherpa
The watch is back up again!

Asking price 14,999.00 EUR.


As I recall, a fellow who states that he owns it does not want anyone to put up his photos, so as a courtesy, I will not do so.

But if you want photos, help yourself!


Cheers,

Joe
 

Joe_A

Moderator
Staff member
Enicaristi
Sherpa
Stephane, not sure about your S/N range, but mine is a 56213x whereas the earliest known S/Ns start at 5617xx according to Nico's site. Mine is a late S/N in the range.

I understand information about the Mark Id is "coming soon ™" on Nico's site. ;)

The watch currently for sale is a 561xxx watch according to what we know, so an earlier watch.

Perhaps the earlier Mark Ids had an unpainted central seconds/chrono hand?
 

Stephanerunge

New member
Sherpa
Min is a 56216x , Steve had another one, maybe sold now, I don't know. But maybe the earlier Mk1d had an unpainted central second hand, I don't know.
Eh Eh Nico...
Stephane
 

Joe_A

Moderator
Staff member
Enicaristi
Sherpa
Min is a 56216x , Steve had another one, maybe sold now, I don't know. But maybe the earlier Mk1d had an unpainted central second hand, I don't know.
Eh Eh Nico...
Stephane

Also . . .

There is another watch for sale that has a legitimate early Mark Id case back, but has the appearance of a gray & white Mark Ic.

Perhaps this is evidence that what we call a Mark Id is a transition watch on the road to the Mark II. Of course, all references are transition watches because they occur between two references, one before and one after. ;)


Interestingly, the seller link refers to a mark Ib, but when you get there it is called a Mark Id.

S/N 562057 confused me. ;)

The seller seems to be a bit confused as well.

To further add to the confusion, the seller shows images of a Mark Ib which was sold earlier within the listing . . . and he swaps the black and the white Tropic straps.

ESG-1d-562057-1.jpg

Case back showing the S/N:


ESG-1d-562057-4.jpg

I suppose it is possible that someone, perhaps even the factory, built a Mark Id but used a mark Ic dial?

However;

I have documented S/N 562032 and it has the expected dial:

562032-1.jpg

562032-2.jpg

So we know that watches with S/Ns before and after 562057 had the later dial with the small logo.

But, no one knows for certain whether watches were assembled and released in serial number sequential order.

A bit of a head-scratcher . . .
 

Joe_A

Moderator
Staff member
Enicaristi
Sherpa
Nico is a busy fellow these days, but it seems that, among the small number of Mark Id documented watches, he has three in his database that are gray & white version Mark Id watches that have dials with the larger logo.

Good to know.

Apparently, so far, the all-white Mark Id watches documented thus far have the newer and smaller logo. I also have one watch in my captured images that appears to be a reverse panda Mark Id with small logo.
 
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